Thomas Cook

[cazza]

Re: Thomas Cook Summer 2011

Thomas Cook Airlines (TCX) will now definately be operating weekly to Antalya*, Dalaman and Palma in house for Thomas Cook holidays during next summer. Along with these, Thomas Cook holidays are expecting to operate for the height of the season extra flights (on top of their allocation of seats with TOM) to Enfidha (New airport for Tunisia / Monastir), using Novelair A320 aircraft.

DSA-AYT SUN (*From August)
DSA-DLM WED
DSA-PMI FRI

 

[News Guru]

[textarea]Thomas Cook add flights from Robin Hood

Thomas Cook has expanded its operations from Doncaster Airport next summer with a new service to Bulgaria from the airport. The weekly flights to Bourgas from Robin Hood Airport will run on Fridays between May 20 and September 30. The flights will be linked to holidays at the Black Sea coastal resort of Sunny Beach for Thomas Cook, Airtours and Direct Holidays.[/textarea]

 

[Aviador]

Yes there's a little bit of spin on behalf of DSA or Thomas Cook but all companies seem to do it these days.

 

[Seasider]

The problem with all this "spin" is the fact that most people realise what is happening and then do not take notice when something serious happens. A bit like the story of the boy who cried wolf.

 

[ryan]

The problem with all this "spin" is the fact that most people realise what is happening and then do not take notice when something serious happens. A bit like the story of the boy who cried wolf.

Actually, the VAST majority of people won't have a clue, see the fact Thomas Cook now "fly" to Bulgaria (or wherever), go on their website, and book. It's only people on these sort of websites that KNOW that it's not a new flight, or Thomas Cook having seats on another operators aircraft, certainly not the majority!

On that note, TCX operated some sort of cruise flight to Barbados today on an A330

 

[Aviador]

Whatever way you look at it I guess it's more bums on seats.

 

[White Heather]

The positive is that without the TCX bums on seats, there must have been a risk that the flight would have been pulled altogether. TOM would not be offering seats to their main competitor otherwise. There was a time not too long ago when it was unheard of for TOM and TCX to be on the same shelf in a Travel Agent, let alone on the same aircraft, and these arragements show only too well that the 'package industry' has changed dramatically.

 

[pug]

This goes some way to explain why HUY has lost so many routes over the last few years. Its due to TOM downsizing and then pretty much pulling out (when the economy went south) and TCX cannot take all of the risk on their own.

Its sharing the risk on these flights and getting a bigger footing by two major companies selling seats.

 

[Aviador]

I am sure one of the locals will correct me if I am wrong but isn't Thomson's upgrading the base for summer 2011 to two Boeing 737-800's as opposed to one 737-800 and one 737-500 (or 300?) This would of course mean that additional capacity is available on many routes for the coming summer so it doesn't necessarily mean the route wasn't workable without offering seats to Thomas Cook. :coco:

 

[pug]

I thought it was operating under BH air?

 

[ryan]

I am sure one of the locals will correct me if I am wrong but isn't Thomson's upgrading the base for summer 2011 to two Boeing 737-800's as opposed to one 737-800 and one 737-500 (or 300?) This would of course mean that additional capacity is available on many routes for the coming summer so it doesn't necessarily mean the route wasn't workable without offering seats to Thomas Cook.

Close, will be two 737-800 and one 737-300 - (up from one -800 and two -300s - an extra 40 seats or so on each flight)

With regards to seats on Thomson taken by Thomas Cook, why wouldn't they? For Thomson, it's a guaranteed seat sold on the aircraft, as the risk is transferred to Thomas Cook to sell them. For Thomas Cook, they have the opportunity to offer holidays from DSA (or anywhere) without the risk of using their own aircraft. In no way does either of these situations imply that Thomson can't fill the plane!

 

[pug]

Put better than I did Ryan.

 

[cazza]

With regards to seats on Thomson taken by Thomas Cook, why wouldn't they? For Thomson, it's a guaranteed seat sold on the aircraft, as the risk is transferred to Thomas Cook to sell them. For Thomas Cook, they have the opportunity to offer holidays from DSA (or anywhere) without the risk of using their own aircraft. In no way does either of these situations imply that Thomson can't fill the plane!

Exactly. Also to clarify TCX has allocations on many if not the majority of TOM services from DSA, just as they both share on each others flights across the UK. By no means by offering an allocation to a tour operator outside your own group does it say that a flight can't attract passenger numbers and would otherwise be pulled at all. It may be however that now the extra 738 capacity will be moved onto the route rather than the 733 that operated it last summer, there will be an increase in seats on the service thus increased oportunities to sell hotels rooms from the other tour operators.

 

[White Heather]

Well this is one we will have to agree to disagree on guys, as Thomson filling their aircraft with TCX and other package tour company customers is usually done because they would not take the risk of selling the entire aircraft capacity on their own - in other words, sharing the risk. It suits TCX as they can sell holidays from DSA without the costs associated with putting their own aircraft and crews in, whilst TOM can ensure that their aircraft are operating pretty much full. As I previously posted, not too long ago, Thomson Group would not even sell holidays operated by their main competitor in their Lunn Poly shops, and vice versa with Airtours shops not selling Thomson. The current policy is one that was introduced mainly after Thomas Cook bought out Airtours, because the market changed as low cost operators became more dominant and working in co-operation with each other made sense.

Incidentally, my comments above are not just my interpretation of the situation - I have been told this by several people working at LBA and within the package tour industry.

 

[ryan]

It happens of many flights though, from all airports - not just between Thomas Cook and Thomson, but other airlines as well. If this supposedly shows a problem, then perhaps it's a problem with the entire package industry? It didn't happen years ago because the market was strong, locos weren't around and there were plenty of tour operators to go around. Recently, many have either gone bankrupt, been swallowed up, or merged, leaving just a few (well, two really - Thomson and Thomas Cook) and a number of smaller ones. It's a different industry to what it used to be, and "sharing the risk" is now the norm. So I'm afraid your interpretation of "flights wouldn't run otherwise" is just incorrect. Even Jet2 at Leeds/elsewhere have tour operators taking seats on their flights - is this because they can't fill the flights, or the fact they want guaranteed sold seats?

 

[pug]

I dont think anyone is saying its a problem. I think TCX are becoming more interested in concentrating on its bigger bases, with LBA needing to be held to keep a foot in the large market there, so they are bound to take seats on TOM flights so that they dont need to use their own equipment, nor do they need to get a third party airline.

This may be off topic and i appologize if so, but several popular destinations have been cut by TCX from HUY over the past couple of years. Many of these were run by third party airlines from bases abroad. Airlines like Spanair, Iberworld, Air Europa and Futura had been used. Most of the routes that were operated by TCX own aircraft are still operated, while the others have been cut. Obviously TOM operate a base at DSA and so any sharing of seats makes more sense from there also.

 

[wilbur2012]

Just a note to add that the originally planned Nouvelair flight to Enfidha for thomas cook seems to of been axed..
Shame but probably since the unrest there it might of been difficult to fill the 2x TOM and the Nouvelair too.

 

[pug]

The flight was axed a few weeks ago, Humberside was able to hold onto their flight for an extra couple of weeks until that was pulled also. Thomson still selling flights to Tunisia from DSA though.

 

[wilbur2012]

I knew that it was pulled a while back I was just on here and thought i should add it as i could not see it.
Hopefully Thomson will be able to fill up their flights..

 

[Aviador]

The uprising has been disastrous for Tunisia and Sharm El Sheikh. I think it will take two or three years to recover, that assuming that democracy has indeed taken hold of the two countries.