Leeds Bradford: TUI Airways Flights, New Routes & Schedule Updates

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Back in the day - pre Doncaster era Tui / Thomson had a very good relationship with LBA and they actively promoted LBA and supported the airports efforts to obtain relaxed night flying hours.

When you look at the cold commercial facts, it’s completely obvious why LBA management pivoted so aggressively.

Thomson may have provided the vital political cover to help the airport win those 24-hour night flying rights in 1994, but a single based aircraft was never going to unlock the airport’s true potential. It was an old school, low-frequency charter model that had hit its ceiling and wasn't providing LBA with the growth it needed.

Then Jet2 turns up in 2003 and completely blows Thomson out of the water. Offering an immediate four-aircraft base with a guaranteed contractual commitment to add at least two aircraft a year for the foreseeable future. It was a commercial proposition no airport operator on the planet could turn down.

Following that, the airport had a spat with Thomson bosses as they were being pushed out of B-Hall. To put this into perspective, it wasn't a case of LBA being deliberately disrespectful to a historic partner, it was a pure capacity play. Jet2 was delivering a massive, high utilisation scheduled network that required priority infrastructure and lightning fast 30-minute turnarounds. Thomson's single aircraft charter operation simply didn't have the commercial weight to demand prime terminal real estate anymore.

Thomson might have used the opening of Doncaster in 2005 as a convenient exit strategy, but looking back, LBA had already backed the absolute right horse for long term passenger volume. Jet2 completely built the modern-day Yeadon we see today.
Excellent summary this.

Not to sound like @LBA4EVER but I wonder what would have happened if we had an extra 250m on the runway to allow for 787 operations. Would the airport have still pivoted to Jet2 or would they have backed TUI with the fact they probably would have delivered Orlando and the Caribbean? Guess we will never know.

So do we all still think there will be an increase in airlines/destinations when the terminal works are completed?

And if not how are the airport are to get to the 7m figure they are aiming for- and must have to be able to pay back the loans on the terminal?
I personally think destinations will grow but airlines probably not. I think the airport will point to the Iran situation possibly knocking the timeline out, but the loss of flights with Sun Express, easyJet and TUI is especially worrying as they are on routes that should perform well. Most airports that are 5m plus seem to be able to sustain 3 based airlines (NCL, LPL, BRS etc.). It’s a worry that LBA can’t.
 
So do we all still think there will be an increase in airlines/destinations when the terminal works are completed?

And if not how are the airport are to get to the 7m figure they are aiming for- and must have to be able to pay back the loans on the terminal?
You may recall that LBA said fairly recently that at the present time, the focus is on increased operations by existing carriers such as Jet2 and Ryanair. There seemed to be an unspoken acceptance that the current situation and impact on aviation, together with UK passenger tax, means attracting new carriers is going to be difficult in the short term at least, but there is clear growth potential with existing carriers through the addition of more based aircraft, more routes, additional frequency, and larger capacity aircraft. We have already seen an additional 5 or 6 routes next year by Jet2 although the question is, will other routes such as to Turkey see cuts? We have already got a 9.5% increase in Ryanair capacity this year, and despite the loss of Sun Express, passenger throughput this year is expected to increase to just short of 5m, another record. And that is despite half the terminal being a building site.

I know it isn't what any of us want. Eggs in too few baskets etc. But the industry in the UK isn't too clever right now, with airlines concentrating on their bases to minimise costs, and airlines such as Wizz questioning if the UK market is even where they want to be - so it could get worse before it gets better.

The fact is though, that the industry is always impacted by what is going on in the world and has ups and downs all the time. We are currently heading into a 'down' but at least when things improve again, LBA will be in a better position to benefit and maybe attract more business. In the meantime, we will need to rely on growing what we have already and hope for maybe the odd additional airline. Lets hope the influence of AENA makes a difference, particularly with Spanish carriers such as Vueling or Iberia Express. Time will tell.
 
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What do folks really expect? Tui bookings are down over 10% this summer…..The travel industry as a whole is struggling at the moment with the cost of living crisis. Plus a number of airlines are struggling with high fuel costs as they failed to hedge enough supply.
I’d also add Tui have had little interest in LBA for years and I’d fully expect IF DSA opens they will pull the LBA flights…..
You may recall that LBA said fairly recently that at the present time, the focus is on increased operations by existing carriers such as Jet2 and Ryanair. There seemed to be an unspoken acceptance that the current situation and impact on aviation, together with UK passenger tax, means attracting new carriers is going to be difficult in the short term at least, but there is clear growth potential with existing carriers through the addition of more based aircraft, more routes, additional frequency, and larger capacity aircraft. We have already seen an additional 5 or 6 routes next year by Jet2 although the question is, will other routes such as to Turkey see cuts? We have already got a 9.5% increase in Ryanair capacity this year, and despite the loss of Sun Express, passenger throughput this year is expected to increase to just short of 5m, another record. And that is despite half the terminal being a building site.

I know it isn't what any of us want. Eggs in too few baskets etc. But the industry in the UK isn't too clever right now, with airlines concentrating on their bases to minimise costs, and airlines such as Wizz questioning if the UK market is even where they want to be - so it could get worse before it gets better.

The fact is though, that the industry is always impacted by what is going on in the world and has ups and downs all the time. We are currently heading into a 'down' but at least when things improve again, LBA will be in a better position to benefit and maybe attract more business. In the meantime, we will need to rely on growing what we have already and hope for maybe the odd additional airline. Let’s hope the influence of AENA makes a difference, particularly with Spanish carriers such as Vueling or Iberia Express. Time will tell.
Despite the loss of what are marginal carriers at LBA the airport os doing OK despite current headwinds in the travel industry….Tui have already reported earlier this year that their bookings are down by at least 10%……
The cost of living crisis, jet fuel issues and a host of other issues are impacting air travel at the moment - against this background I wouldn’t be surprised to see some further consolidation at LBA and elsewhere……
Everyone would love to see linear growth at the airport but the industry just doesn’t work that way……
 
You may recall that LBA said fairly recently that at the present time, the focus is on increased operations by existing carriers such as Jet2 and Ryanair. There seemed to be an unspoken acceptance that the current situation and impact on aviation, together with UK passenger tax, means attracting new carriers is going to be difficult in the short term at least, but there is clear growth potential with existing carriers through the addition of more based aircraft, more routes, additional frequency, and larger capacity aircraft. We have already seen an additional 5 or 6 routes next year by Jet2 although the question is, will other routes such as to Turkey see cuts? We have already got a 9.5% increase in Ryanair capacity this year, and despite the loss of Sun Express, passenger throughput this year is expected to increase to just short of 5m, another record. And that is despite half the terminal being a building site.

I know it isn't what any of us want. Eggs in too few baskets etc. But the industry in the UK isn't too clever right now, with airlines concentrating on their bases to minimise costs, and airlines such as Wizz questioning if the UK market is even where they want to be - so it could get worse before it gets better.

The fact is though, that the industry is always impacted by what is going on in the world and has ups and downs all the time. We are currently heading into a 'down' but at least when things improve again, LBA will be in a better position to benefit and maybe attract more business. In the meantime, we will need to rely on growing what we have already and hope for maybe the odd additional airline. Lets hope the influence of AENA makes a difference, particularly with Spanish carriers such as Vueling or Iberia Express. Time will tell.
The suggestion that airlines using LBA could use larger aircraft is a little optimistic. We believe that Jet2 are years away from making Leeds an A321 base and Ryanair are years away from having anything bigger than the Max 8 and even though they have plenty of the 8's they dont maximise their use at Leeds. Wizz operate 321's but dont seem to be inclined to increase their offering, in fact just the opposite.

Airlines decide what aircraft to operate and its all well and good the airport identifying this as something to potentially boost passenger figures, but its something they have no control over whatsoever.

I would like to know the real reason why stand construction has stopped. I suspect it was AENA who applied their experience from other airports without actually understanding the vagueries of LBA.

Having said all the foregoing I am hoping for more growth from existing carriers with existing equipment once the public realise that the terminal disruption is over and start booking Leeds flights in larger numbers. The airport need a very high profile media campaign to ensure this happens.
 
The suggestion that airlines using LBA could use larger aircraft is a little optimistic. We believe that Jet2 are years away from making Leeds an A321 base and Ryanair are years away from having anything bigger than the Max 8 and even though they have plenty of the 8's they dont maximise their use at Leeds. Wizz operate 321's but dont seem to be inclined to increase their offering, in fact just the opposite.

Airlines decide what aircraft to operate and its all well and good the airport identifying this as something to potentially boost passenger figures, but its something they have no control over whatsoever.

I would like to know the real reason why stand construction has stopped. I suspect it was AENA who applied their experience from other airports without actually understanding the vagueries of LBA.

Having said all the foregoing I am hoping for more growth from existing carriers with existing equipment once the public realise that the terminal disruption is over and start booking Leeds flights in larger numbers. The airport need a very high profile media campaign to ensure this happens.
LBA are in discussions daily with their airline partners and will have far more visibility on what plans they have to base which types of aircraft and when than anyone on here has……I suspect one of the reasons for the stand construction not proceeding at this time is it isn’t needed yet and the fact that there have been well publicised costs overruns on the the terminal regen..,,,LBA also made clear that it has had to scale back significantly some of their future investment as a result of operational cost increases such as a very significant increase in business rates…..I’m sure people would want to ensure the terminal regen completes to plan rather than an increase in the amount of concrete space……
As to AENA it’s very disingenuous to suggest they didnt understand LBA - having been involved in multi million £ mergers and acquisitions i know from experience that they will have undertaken full and detailed due diligence on LBA, fully reviewed its operating environment, strategy, spoken to airline partners and reviewed its P &L before they committed 1 euro to the transaction……
 
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So do we all still think there will be an increase in airlines/destinations when the terminal works are completed?

And if not how are the airport are to get to the 7m figure they are aiming for- and must have to be able to pay back the loans on the terminal?
Well apparently according to what many including some members have said on here once the terminal is finally completed airlines will be queuing up to fly from LBA! This really will be the big daddy moment of truth, we shall see,if this happens then brilliant but if not and absolutely bugger all as per usual occures then alarm bells will be ringing! Will the stigma of LBA go, will LBA management secure those airlines we've always desperatly wanted here, we shall see but something needs to happen big time!
 
LBA are in discussions daily with their airline partners and will have far more visibility on what plans they have to base which types of aircraft and when than anyone on here has……I suspect one of the reasons for the stand construction not proceeding at this time is it isn’t needed yet and the fact that there have been well publicised costs overruns on the the terminal regen..,,,LBA also made clear that it has had to scale back significantly some of their future investment as a result of operational cost increases such as a very significant increase in business rates…..I’m sure people would want to ensure the terminal regen completes to plan rather than an increase in the amount of concrete space……
As to AENA it’s very disingenuous to suggest they didnt understand LBA - having been involved in multi million £ mergers and acquisitions i know from experience that they will have undertaken full and detailed due diligence on LBA, fully reviewed its operating environment, strategy, spoken to airline partners and reviewed its P &L before they committed 1 euro to the transaction……
Im sure negotiations are ongoing, thats the aviation directors job after all.

Whilst they may be courting new airlines and probably have been for many years the reality is that we are dependent on two carriers neither of whom can offer growth based on larger aircraft. They may be able to grow their businesses by operating more flights but could be constrained by a lack of stands.
 
I’d also add Tui have had little interest in LBA for years and I’d fully expect IF DSA opens they will pull the LBA flights…..
That completely misreads TUI's modern corporate operating model. The idea that they have 'little interest' in LBA because they don't have rows of based aircraft here belongs to the 1990s charter era, TUI's strategy has fundamentally moved on.

Today, TUI are risk managers, not just aircraft operators. They don't need a massive, expensive based fleet at Yeadon because they successfully squeeze huge margins out of West Yorkshire by cherry picking traffic via non-based aircraft, W patterns, and third party airlines. TUI’s group strategy right now is explicitly focused on selling more package holidays using seats on rival low cost carriers like Ryanair. They can capture the high yield Leeds and Bradford market without taking on any of the massive fixed overheads or operational risks of running a dedicated regional base.

Dropping LBA completely if DSA reopens would be corporate suicide in the region. If TUI walks away from LBA, they aren't 'moving' that traffic to Doncaster, they are completely handing the West Yorkshire catchment to Jet2 on a silver platter. Expecting families from Headingley or Ilkley to trek down the A1 to Doncaster just to buy a TUI package is a fantasy.

The cold reality is that TUI have spent the last few years successfully absorbing their old South Yorkshire demand into their heavily consolidated hubs at Manchester and East Midlands, while maintaining a lean, high yield tap at LBA. They might play along publicly with Doncaster Council to see what kind of taxpayer funded sweeteners are on the table, but they aren't going to dismantle a highly efficient, profitable, and de-risked revenue stream at LBA just to go all in on a highly volatile, cash strapped project further south.
 
That completely misreads TUI's modern corporate operating model. The idea that they have 'little interest' in LBA because they don't have rows of based aircraft here belongs to the 1990s charter era, TUI's strategy has fundamentally moved on.

Today, TUI are risk managers, not just aircraft operators. They don't need a massive, expensive based fleet at Yeadon because they successfully squeeze huge margins out of West Yorkshire by cherry picking traffic via non-based aircraft, W patterns, and third party airlines. TUI’s group strategy right now is explicitly focused on selling more package holidays using seats on rival low cost carriers like Ryanair. They can capture the high yield Leeds and Bradford market without taking on any of the massive fixed overheads or operational risks of running a dedicated regional base.

Dropping LBA completely if DSA reopens would be corporate suicide in the region. If TUI walks away from LBA, they aren't 'moving' that traffic to Doncaster, they are completely handing the West Yorkshire catchment to Jet2 on a silver platter. Expecting families from Headingley or Ilkley to trek down the A1 to Doncaster just to buy a TUI package is a fantasy.

The cold reality is that TUI have spent the last few years successfully absorbing their old South Yorkshire demand into their heavily consolidated hubs at Manchester and East Midlands, while maintaining a lean, high yield tap at LBA. They might play along publicly with Doncaster Council to see what kind of taxpayer funded sweeteners are on the table, but they aren't going to dismantle a highly efficient, profitable, and de-risked revenue stream at LBA just to go all in on a highly volatile, cash strapped project further south.
I'm not entirely sure about that in respect of the TUI Airways flights. They seem to be Marella Cruise centric and I feel that most cruise goers would, unfortunately, follow them to DSA!
My wife and I flew LBA to CFU to join a cruise last year and a lot of people on the flight/cruise were previous users of DSA. Indeed we did the same flight this year, only a matter of a few weeks ago, this time to stay on Corfu and there were only 2 mini buses of passengers not joining the cruise ship!
We are cruising again next year - LBA to PMI and I bet most on the flight will be for Marella.
If they switch the operation to the White Elephant in future years that will be me done with them but I fear I will be in a small minority!
 
I'm not entirely sure about that in respect of the TUI Airways flights. They seem to be Marella Cruise centric and I feel that most cruise goers would, unfortunately, follow them to DSA!
My wife and I flew LBA to CFU to join a cruise last year and a lot of people on the flight/cruise were previous users of DSA. Indeed we did the same flight this year, only a matter of a few weeks ago, this time to stay on Corfu and there were only 2 mini buses of passengers not joining the cruise ship!
We are cruising again next year - LBA to PMI and I bet most on the flight will be for Marella.
If they switch the operation to the White Elephant in future years that will be me done with them but I fear I will be in a small minority!

When TUI moved to DSA, TUI kept a token presence at LBA operating the Marella cruise linked flights to Corfu & Palma. Hell if I remember correctly they even sent a Boeing 767-300 in on a w-legged Thursday afternoon.
I am 100% certain they would do same again as TUI know there cruise market is high yielding out of LBA. It was only last week TUI & the Airport did a joint travel trade event at Headingley Stadium.
 
When TUI moved to DSA, TUI kept a token presence at LBA operating the Marella cruise linked flights to Corfu & Palma. Hell if I remember correctly they even sent a Boeing 767-300 in on a w-legged Thursday afternoon.
I am 100% certain they would do same again as TUI know there cruise market is high yielding out of LBA. It was only last week TUI & the Airport did a joint travel trade event at Headingley Stadium.
Thanks for that lbaspotter, you've put my mind at rest somewhat!
I have to say that both last year and this, the flights were 100% full.
 
According to CAA stats (a very useful feature of them is that TUI is listed under charter passengers) TUI flights are always very full. I contrast that to, for example, tomorrow's early Ryanair inbound from PMI with about 25 passengers (outbound has about 180), but they seem to be happy enough with a much higher frequency. Having read @Aviador's summary, what was said makes good sense, just a shame that's the only segment of the Yorkshire market TUI seem to be interested in, if they were interested they'd happily support at least a 2-3 aircraft base, even with Jet2 squeezing them
 
According to CAA stats (a very useful feature of them is that TUI is listed under charter passengers) TUI flights are always very full. I contrast that to, for example, tomorrow's early Ryanair inbound from PMI with about 25 passengers (outbound has about 180), but they seem to be happy enough with a much higher frequency. Having read @Aviador's summary, what was said makes good sense, just a shame that's the only segment of the Yorkshire market TUI seem to be interested in, if they were interested they'd happily support at least a 2-3 aircraft base, even with Jet2 squeezing them
TUI's planes from LBA are almost always packed to the rafters, but that highlights a fundamental difference in business models between an inclusive tour (IT) operator and a pure low cost carrier like Ryanair.

Ryanair is a high frequency, volume driven asset machine. Their business relies on keeping their aircraft moving constantly. If an inbound plane from Palma drops tomorrow with only 25 passengers, Ryanair’s planners won't panic. They look at the round trip yield. That exact same hull is taking 180 outbound passengers paying peak summer fares, and the empty inbound legs are just a necessary by-product of maintaining an intense, multi daily frequency that captures dominant market share. Because their overheads are diluted across thousands of flights, they can easily absorb a few low yield directional legs.

TUI operates on the exact opposite logic. Because they are primarily selling high margin holiday packages (flight + hotel + transfers), they cannot afford empty legs. Every single empty seat represents a massive chunk of lost holiday revenue. Therefore, they only deploy capacity where they are 100% guaranteed a near perfect load factor in both directions.

It is a massive shame that they treat Leeds & West Yorkshire as just a lean overflow valve rather than committing to a 2 to 3 aircraft base. But with Jet2 standing as the entrenched local hero at LBA already holding the exact high frequency, multi aircraft base that TUI lacks, TUI knows that trying to match them head to head would trigger a bloody yield war they simply don't need, especially when they can easily route that massive South Yorkshire and East Midlands demand through their consolidated bases further down the motorway.

Thanks for that lbaspotter, you've put my mind at rest somewhat!
I have to say that both last year and this, the flights were 100% full.
Yes and even if the relationship between the airport an TUI had soured back in the days of Bridgepoint, the airport has new owners now who will be keen to rebuild that relationship.
 
Although the seeming lack of enthusiasm by TUI and some other airlines for LBA is disappointing I’d rather Jet2 and Ryanair dominate than watch tumbleweeds blowing across a dusty runway.
Agree - and heading towards 5M pax per year.
Not too bad for a "cabbage patch on a hill" as a former military pilot once called it!
 
I had a thought today, I wonder if TUI might relook to Turkish Charter Airline Freebird to operate its Turkish flights from Leeds again as they did before Sun Express Turned up?

But I would much rather have a replacement scheduled service by either Corendon Airlines, Pegasus, Mavi Gok or even Southwind Airlines who are now allowed back into the UK & Europe.
 
I had a thought today, I wonder if TUI might relook to Turkish Charter Airline Freebird to operate its Turkish flights from Leeds again as they did before Sun Express Turned up?

But I would much rather have a replacement scheduled service by either Corendon Airlines, Pegasus, Mavi Gok or even Southwind Airlines who are now allowed back into the UK & Europe.
For me id like pegasus here at LBA, turkish TK are too well established at MAN and would not want to affect their loads out of the airport where as pegasus have less pressence there so a nice 50/50 balance of LBA/MAN would be ideal without affecting their MAN loads too much. Anything would be nice atm though!!
 
Sadly I can’t see Pegaus picking up the Antalya route either scheduled or on a charter basis for TUI Hoildays.

Over the years they have successfully turned from Charter into predominantly a low cost airline operation with a huge Hub operation through Istanbul Sabiha Gokcen Int’l airport. Now I agree that would be a nice addition to the LBA network!
 

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For some weird reason, my days off work tend to involve being out of my flat by 5am and not getting back until 10pm. Back to work and the regular "fix" of 7.40am to 7.15pm hours
Heatwave Mk2 next week?
Some explosive weather build-ups currently in the North of England. What is it like where you are?
LBA: B737-300 G-GDFK empty down to Paris at 16:15 to operate the return LS268 back to Leeds 20:00 ETA where it will then operate the delayed LS265 to Malaga 20:40ETD
LBA: Albastar B737-800 EC-MUB positioning in tommorow afternoon from Gatwick 15:45 to operate a charter to Lourdes/Tarbes on Friday afternoon 14:00 AP7721 STC
I don't believe I am quite covering enough roles at work. Its now 4 on a bad day, 5 on a good day and there is scope for a 6th and 7th role. Still on minimum pay but had the biggest payrise in the company,

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