BA CityFlyer

[TheLocalYokel]

Florence

FLR-BRS and BRS-FLR operated today. First time for three weeks that both sectors operated.

 

[Kernow Bravo]

Apparently so. However, according to ba.com FLR-BRS arrived around 90 mins late and then BRS-FLR arrived 1822 (scheduled 1625). Better than not operating at all but far from satisfactory performance, particularly for an aircraft operating so few rotations in the day.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Apparently so. However, according to ba.com FLR-BRS arrived around 90 mins late and then BRS-FLR arrived 1822 (scheduled 1625). Better than not operating at all but far from satisfactory performance, particularly for an aircraft operating so few rotations in the day.

I wonder whether it will operate in summer 2019. When I last looked at the BA rolling timetable (bookable for about 12 months ahead) it was shown as operating in the early months of next summer but as we know that sort of long range timetabling can be altered, by any airline.

The problems BACF has had with it this summer might persuade the airline that its continuance next year is not worth the bother. I don't know Italy well but is the daily easyJet to Pisa really out of the question for Florence? The journey between the two by rail is apparently about an hour with a good frequency. The loads on the Pisa service this summer have been high with quite a number of sell-outs shown on the easyJet booking website so it's unlikely to see a reduction next summer.

 

[Kernow Bravo]

The problems BACF has had with it this summer might persuade the airline that its continuance next year is not worth the bother. I don't know Italy well but is the daily easyJet to Pisa really out of the question for Florence? The journey between the two by rail is apparently about an hour with a good frequency. The loads on the Pisa service this summer have been high with quite a number of sell-outs shown on the easyJet booking website so it's unlikely to see a reduction next summer.

FLR has had constraints with runway length not dissimilar to those at LCY, so historically PSA has been the primary international airport for Florence (hence the good rail service you mention). Upgrades to the rail system in Italy now mean that even central Bologna is only around an hour from Florence, although I'm not aware of a direct rail link from BLQ.

So there are realistic alternatives to FLR as a gateway to Florence.

Not sure if the BACF issues are related specifically to the E170 as I have read. Seemingly BACF have operated E190 from BHX, and an SN A319 is rostered to operate our return trip via BRU next month, so it is possible that they have mitigated some of the runway constraints at FLR (it used to be only RJ-45s and BAE 146s or turboprops which operated there!)

 

[Severn]

The runway in FLR is 5,200ft long (a little shorter than SOU). It used to be only 4,500ft which is why it was limited to regional jets. It has a large mountain at one end of the runway meaning runway operations are limited and congestion on the ground is likely due to nearly all traffic arriving and departing from/to the South (one way in, same way out). This along with a limited number of parking stands mean delays are likely.

The biggest commercial aircraft now using FLR are A319s used by Iberia, Brussels, Alitalia and Vueling base three of them at FLR. Air France uses A318s and apart from the odd CityJet RJ85 all other operators use the E170/190 series aircraft.

I think BACF may have been caught short a few times with their scheduling of their crews and flights to/from FLR. The crews are scheduled to operate LCY-FLR-BRS-FLR and due to all the current ATC delays across Europe as well as an often delay-ridden airport like FLR then unsurprisingly the LCY-FLR flight is often delayed leading to the delays on the BRS flights which can lead to cancelations.

 

[Marko1]

BA have pulled out of brs and bhx.

 

[Jerry]

Guess the regional sun routes aren't successful enough.

 

[Marko1]

It's a real shame. That means that all the new airlines have gone or going ( wizz an exception ). Not good at all. I was hoping that they would expand not go

 

[Kernow Bravo]

Agree this is a shame.

My recent flight to FLR was reminiscent of the old BA, with excellent cabin crew. Alas this was undermined by being delayed by an hour. Onboard service was probably more generous than even Flybmi - people in front of me gave back two gin miniatures because they didn't want doubles! Perhaps therein lies the issue.

It struck me as quite an odd strategy though - trying to run scheduled 'charter flights' Sat - Sat against the various incumbent carriers offering similar routings at BRS, all with presumably much lower cost bases.

BA might have had more luck taking advantage of BM's lack of reliability and/or feeding into Finnair's eastbound long haul network at HEL to compete with KL, albeit at the risk of canibilising their own long haul offering. Either option would require an operation beyond just Saturdays though.

 

[Jerry]

Yeah it is a shame i think there was hope it would lead to more not just for BRS but other airports.
Must be frustrating for BRS itself in not being able to keep non based airlines.

 

[Foxlimayankee]

Is there a source for this?

BA are said to have been most happy with the current setup of the summer weekend flights in general, not specific to BRS, but it appears on the face of it the operational setup of these flights has been a complete mess. Continual schedule changes, poor timings (mainly at BHX in the first year) and various delays/cancellation this year couldn't have done the routes any favours.
The purpose behind the routes is to utilise the aircraft during the weekends when there's no use for them at LCY. From what I know they weren't particularly bothered about getting exceptional performance, but at least utilising the aircraft rather than having them parked up.

I can't see why these routes wouldn't work, especially from BRS. AGP, PMI and IBZ are all very popular routes, even with FR and EZY's frequencies flights are often full. I'm sure there would be a market for people that would want to avoid the LC's and frequent flyers that would use BA specifically. A shame if this is true. I really can't see them expanding into the regions on business routes unless they wanted to kill off BM. LCY is the home fort.

 

[Marko1]

Have had confirmation from the airport as well now. Bye bye BA again !

 

[superking]

The series from BHX has been pulled for next summer as well.

 

[superking]

With all the problems with flights cancelled and poor timings, this was the best thing that has happened. With all that in mind is to find another operator or see if the LCC wants to add extra rotations. Any thing has to be better if the flights operate every week.

 

[Jerry]

With all the problems with flights cancelled and poor timings, this was the best thing that has happened. With all that in mind is to find another operator or see if the LCC wants to add extra rotations. Any thing has to be better if the flights operate every week.

Yes there was problems but from the airports point of view having BA flying from the airport in some people's view would've added some sort of prestige. What is more important though is that they haven't been able to keep hold of another non based airline and that may well be a concern for them.

 

[BRSregular]

Completely agree with the previous comment regarding feeding into Finnair’s network. Could a daily Helsinki route work? KLM seem to do pretty well using 3 or 4 larger planes each day to feed into their network.

 

[KARFA]

Completely agree with the previous comment regarding feeding into Finnair’s network. Could a daily Helsinki route work? KLM seem to do pretty well using 3 or 4 larger planes each day to feed into their network.

AY could be interested in starting a route to HEL but I can’t see why BACF would be interested in feeding AY long haul flights?

 

[Jerry]

Completely agree with the previous comment regarding feeding into Finnair’s network. Could a daily Helsinki route work? KLM seem to do pretty well using 3 or 4 larger planes each day to feed into their network.

I'm wondering whether you've posted this in the wrong thread and if this post was meant for the Route Development thread and not the BA Cityflyer thread?

 

[Kernow Bravo]

I'm wondering whether you've posted this in the wrong thread and if this post was meant for the Route Development thread and not the BA Cityflyer thread?

Apologies if my earlier comment about what BACF might have done differently has inadvertently caused thread drift.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Foxlimayankee has outlined BACF's questionable strategy implementation with the routes, with both BHX and BRS suffering from poor decisions at times. The axing might say more about the airline than the airports.