Flybe

[ChurchFenton]

I have thought this over and over.......DSA has no distinctive advantage over LBIA , Im thinking in terms of geographical location , infrastructure or transport connections ( correct me if Im wrong )

Re geographical location and infrastructure, the following factors could have partly influenced Flybe in their choice of DSA:

Less severe weather
Improving access links from nearby motorway

Also, having no direct competition at DSA may end up as having balanced to some degree the smaller catchment.

Anyone east of Leeds and as far north as York are likely to give LBA and DSA almost equal consideration when looking at flight options. Whilst we're all aware of the passenger leakage that heads west to Manchester, increasing options from DSA may see a few more LBA regulars on the eastern side of LBA's catchment heading in the other direction. One can only hope Bridgepoint wake up sooner rather than later, if they have any interest at all in developing their investment further.

 

[stars&sids]

You're all sort of assuming that existing LBA pax won't travel to DSA unless it's much cheaper. But what if a big percentage of those pax are already travelling from South Yorks, Lincolnshire and Humberside to LBA ?
I'm in Doncaster and know for a fact that many people travel to Leeds , Manchester and East Mids to fly. - These people now have an option to save a bit of travel time, and not have to battle through Leeds, or down the M1 / M62. From what I've checked out so far, the Flybe fares aren't stunningly cheap, but they're not overpriced either, and I feel pretty certain that, with the odd exception, this programme is a good one for Doncaster Sheffield Airport. The Med Sun destinations are particularly welcome in addressing the need for seat only options that are not really viable on the existing TOM services, as these are always way too high due to the flights filling quickly with I T holidaymakers.

 

[rmac]

Maybe, I don't know, LBA management did not want Flybe on their terms and a deal was off. After all Flybe have chopped and changed routes, Southampton on-off, Aberdeen on-off. Other airports have suffered the same, eg Bournemouth. So Flybe went off to DSA !! LBA now may wish to encourage the likes of Bmi for a FRA service as they may wish to ditch a DSA/FRA service as mooted a while back. I think Bmi would do far better to operate out of LBA rather than DSA anyway and maybe restart the BRU service (and others) Also who knows what LBA management are doing to help new start up ExtraJet. They plan, all being well, to target business routes out of LBA which are very much needed. Maybe a CDG twice daily is on the cards along with CPH. Personally I do not think LBA will be losing much sleep over the new Flybe set up which is a big gamble - who else have had plans for DSA which in the end proved unworkable. Possibly though the new road link will help Flybe to make it work. The planned better access for LBA will also improve matters for those who choose this airport.

 

[lbaspotter]

Like I said earlier I think flybe's sun routes to Faro, Alicante, Malaga will do well. They have no competition on Berlin which should help them. Newquay is an unknown it might do well it might not? Amsterdam been one daily mid morning departure without a KLM codeshare will be a hard task to fill when you've got direct competition from KLM at both Leeds and Humberside. Its surely going to attract the Jet2 stag and hen do's. I still think 2x daily to Paris is over kill in capacity using the Embraer's. It would have been better to use Dash 8'S and even better with an Air France codeshare. Going daily on Jersey using Embraer 190 seriously is a missive increase from the current 1x weekly Embraer 170.Even jet2 struggle to fill 3x weekly Boeing 737-300 from Leeds.

"rmac" From what I heard recently they might well be the potential of bmi regional switching its planned Donny - Frankfurt service to Leeds. Not saying it will happen though as I hear it might depend on what Extrajet have planned and if they still intend to lease 2x Embraer aircraft from bmi regional. But that's for another discussion thread on here.

I've got to remind myself to be careful not to go too far of topic as this is the Flybe thread for LBA. Not DSA or extrajet...

 

[Bigman]

I wonder what Thomo's will think of having direct competition on Faro, Malaga and Palma on their doorstep.

 

[a300boy]

They have competition on these routes just about every where they operate from so I doubt they will be too bothered. The E190 is not the fastest jet aircraft so the extra time on the journey and the more cramped cabin might be a factor against Flybe.

 

[Seasider]

I think that it is time for all to be patient on the DSA ops.
LBA - BHD carries far too many pax for Flybe to drop it .
I used the "shuttle" to JER in Feb at £60 return. That's why it was probable axed - low yield.

 

[imagineif]

Flybe will have got a sweet deal at DSA and the airport will be making peanuts. This is flybe we are talking about here, they will chop and change the program and axe routes at the drop of a hat. My prediction is significant reductions in frequency and eventual equipment change before even pulling the plug in the end. Flybe got it dead wrong with the E195 - it doesnt have a place anywhere on its network and they are desperately trying to create markets for it!

They tried to get shut of them but that didnt work, so they are now stuck with them. DSA is a carbon copy of the set up you now see at Cardiff. However the government owned Cardiff airport knowing flybe's business practices .... made them sign a 10 year deal.

There was much fanfare at the arrival of Easyjet... we know how that ended.

This could not have happened at LBA - it would have upset several established carriers and severely rock the boat. The last thing LBA needs is more capacity on routes already served... I even think the introduction of Vueling is overkill on the BCN. There is a need for niche markets to be tapped and still some key business routes, but we pretty much now have the world at our fingertips with connections via DUB/AMS/LHR with Aer Lingus, KLM & BA.

 

[jfy1999]

Flybe got it dead wrong with the E195 - it doesnt have a place anywhere on its network and they are desperately trying to create markets for it!

I don't wholly agree with that, I think Flybe have found the E195 works on certain routes from MAN and BHX (especially CDG, MXP and TXL). Those routes are all getting great load factors right now, especially BHX—Berlin. But I do think it's madness for them to send E195s to DSA and CWL when they could as easily have sent Q400s.

 

[Seasider]

Flybe got it dead wrong with the E195 - it doesnt have a place anywhere on its network and they are desperately trying to create markets for it!

I don't wholly agree with that, I think Flybe have found the E195 works on certain routes from MAN and BHX (especially CDG, MXP and TXL). Those routes are all getting great load factors right now, especially BHX—Berlin. But I do think it's madness for them to send E195s to DSA and CWL when they could as easily have sent Q400s.

They had to find work for the EMB195. It doesn't matter that the dash8 would have been more suitable.

 

[User001]

The E195 could have replaced the dash 8 on more established routes at bases such as MAN/BHX/BHD, then in turn the freed up dash could have opened the CWL/DSA routes.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

The E195 could have replaced the dash 8 on more established routes at bases such as MAN/BHX/BHD, then in turn the freed up dash could have opened the CWL/DSA routes.

I found it hard to understand why Flybe would return to CWL with two based E 195s having given up all routes bar one at that airport just a year before saying they were loss making; these routes had been operated by Dash 8s, albeit none based at CWL.

The general consensus amongst those with an interest in CWL matters is that the £13 million (over three years) route fund war chest provided by the Wales Assembly Government was the reason for the volte-face but that still did not provide an answer as to why the E195 was the chosen aircraft, a type clearly too big for many of the routes it operates at CWL when it comes to getting anywhere near filling the aircraft.

 

[imagineif]

Its nuts.. flybe constantly dips it's toes in and out of markets and throws up bases as quick as it closes them down.

Nobody has to agree with me on the E195 - but flybe themselves have confessed they should not have purchased them. They didn't generate the return expected on bucket & spade routes due to the fuel costs at the time - plus the E195 seats over 100 pax and so a 3rd cabin crew member is needed. They should have got E190's - they then went and made the same mistake with the E170, an aircraft that is nearly as heavy as the E175 but seats less passengers... go figure? They have had further delivery of these on hold.

Heavier than the E190, more crew needed and more fuel needed - all in the peak of the recession. The E195 has simply not worked for flybe - they tried to lease and sell them off but the Russian Customers went bust. Now they are trying to find work for them in flybe again with these new bases. They even have a name for the E195 project its called "project blackbird".

A full aircraft does not always equate to profit.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

A full aircraft does not always equate to profit.

Indeed and perhaps nowhere better illustrated than by Ryanair that has axed routes that regularly pulled in monthly load factors in excess of 90%, well in excess in some instances.

However, the low prices that Flybe has been charging allied to poor seat occupancy rates at (at least) one of its 195 bases suggests strongly that the airline is relying on (legal it would seem) subsidies from an airport that is state owned. Can't blame Flybe for this - any business would be unlikely to resist a goose making up to them with golden eggs to distribute.

That being so it might be that so long as the subsidies remain Flybe sees it as an opportunity to use its E195s in a more promising environment.

 

[lbaspotter]

Don't know why this has happened but Flybe seem to have added a 5th daily Leeds/Bradford - Belfast City rotation operating on the following dates only

BE733 = BHD 12:50 - 13:50 /BE734 = LBA 14:15 - BHD 15:15

Friday, Feb 12th
Wednesday, Feb 17th
Thursday, Feb 18th

 

[Aviador]

Don't know why this has happened but Flybe seem to have added a 5th daily Leeds/Bradford - Belfast City rotation operating on the following dates only

BE733 = BHD 12:50 - 13:50 /BE734 = LBA 14:15 - BHD 15:15

Friday, Feb 12th
Wednesday, Feb 17th
Thursday, Feb 18th

Do you think it's because of the prospect of Ryanair operating BFS?

 

[Bigman]

Isn't it school holidays next week?

 

[oldendays]

I may be mistaken but I believe it was March 1991 that Flybe took on the Leeds to Belfast City service from Capital. If so we're on the point of the (silver) twenty fifth anniversary. Quite an achievement for the airline and both airports.

Of course it was Jersey European Airways back then, then British European and now Flybe.

 

[lbaspotter]

Understand the start date of the new Leeds/Bradford - Newquay service has been slightly delayed until the winter 2016/17 timetable with a possible route launch date from Sunday October 30th with a 5x weekly service operating Mon, Wed, Fri, Sat & Sun. So watch this space!

Big give away is the winter 2016/17 timetable which was released for sale earlier today. Basically it shows the Leeds/Bradford - Belfast City route getting a 5th daily rotation on Tue and Thu whilst on Mon, Wed, Fri it looks like the aircraft is on the deck at Leeds/Bradford from 10:20 until 14:20, Sat between 11:10 & 15:25 and Sun between 10:00 & 14:20

 

[White Heather]

It would seem like an odd decision to launch Newquay just as the busiest period ends - although this IS Flybe!!