Cardiff Airport - General Thread

[TheLocalYokel]

Hello E m - good to hear from you again.

I take your point about hospital CEOs and indeed CEOs in other industries. If you have that sort of skill and the relevant experience doing this type of job it then I agree it doesn't necessarily require a background in that particular industry.

As it happens Jon Horne has an immense knowledge of the industry especially the South Wales scene and in that sense his chief of staff (this title is new to me in aviation) need not necessarily be so versed but it obviously helps. The trouble is no-one outside CWL and the WG seems to know what is Jason Thomas's role (the civil servant in question) and to what extent it might cut across that of the airport CEO.

Now that Jon Horne has left there is an interim managing director but no chief executive and, according to the newspaper report quoted above, the post is yet to be advertised. I'm not quite sure of the difference between a CEO and an MD at CWL. It might just be a nomenclature devised in case the current interim MD does not become the next CEO.

The current interim MD's background is mainly in military aviation and I'm pretty sure she's never been in charge of an important civil airport before. I have no doubt she's highly competent as a leader and there are good people around her with considerable experience and excellent contacts in the industry, not least Spencer Birns.

Nevertheless, the position of Jason Thomas has provoked some discussion in at least one website devoted to Welsh aviation with conjecture as to the reasons for JH's departure.

I also agree that the tv company would almost certainly have complete editorial control over what is shown in each episode - Jason Thomas did also feature in the second episode quite prominently - and to that extent what is shown is their decision and not the airport's.

If, as you suggest, Mr Thomas (and I cast no aspersions about his ability as a civil servant working at the airport - it's his role that is more of a puzzle) is on secondment at civil service rates of pay I presume the airport company would have to reimburse the WG. I know it's really a case of Peter paying Paul but if there is no reimbursement then the airport company's accounts would obviously benefit in a small way.

 

[Em0866]

Thanks Local. Yes I was aware of Mr Horne's wealth of experience in the civil aviation field and did a lot of good for the airport when he was there...both recently and in the past. It is a big loss for the airport. We can speculate until the cows come home as to why he left (as they are doing on the other website) but it is unlikely that we will ever know for sure why he went so quickly.

As for Mr Thomas' role, who knows. I would imagine that Mr Thomas (if he is on secondment) is still employed by the Welsh Government and paid by them too...that is what I think anyway. If the airport is paying him then the Welsh Government then I would assume that WG would reimburse the airport.

With the recent announcement of the withdrawal of the Glasgow service with CityJet, is not good news...but if bums are not on seats then it is no surprise that this has happened. With BRS being so close and easyjet's cheaper fares, I think it would be difficult to get this route back.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

GLA is not as popular a route as EDI, and not just from CWL; the BRS-GLA route sees a lower frequency and fewer passengers than BRS-EDI and EXT won't have a direct GLA route this winter either. Passengers from there will no longer have a non-stop Flybe route but will have to change aircraft at MAN.

It's probably a better option than driving to BRS from South Wales or using the EDI route from CWL and travelling onto GLA by bus or train, but not much better in my view.

As for a new carrier to GLA, I suppose it's all down to how much the WG not only wants this core domestic route back as well as not wanting the perception to gain ground that the airport's recent green shoots of recovery are already dying back, and how much it's prepared to pay for the route.

With the recently reported £3 million earmarked in the WG budget for route development there is clearly an intention to oil wheels and, although there are regulations in place that don't permit unlimited public money being utilised (and in some ways the WG as owner is in a slightly more difficult position in this regard than a private owner), there are usually ways around such obstacles. The 'black arts' was how a Wales newspaper described it some months ago.

It may be that the £3 million won't become available until the next financial year in which case CityJet might be tempted back onto the GLA from April if any subsidy is acceptable to them.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

[textarea]Conservatives attack Welsh Government over use of Cardiff Airport for overseas trade missions

The Welsh Government has come under fire from the Conservatives for not using Cardiff Airport more when flying overseas on trade missions.

The airport is used when “practical” according to the Welsh Government, which bought the facility last year – but a spokesman said it is often not used by North and Mid Wales companies flying on trade missions.

Shadow Transport Minister Byron Davies said: “Labour Ministers bought Cardiff Airport with £52m of taxpayers’ cash, but don’t even have the confidence in it to use the airport for their own foreign trips.

“It is difficult to market Cardiff Airport as the gateway to hundreds of global destinations via Schiphol in Amsterdam if the Labour Ministers who bought it prefer to fly from Heathrow.

“Carwyn Jones and his Labour globetrotters should fly from Cardiff on trade missions to send a clear message that Cardiff Airport is open for business to encourage tourist and business travellers to Wales.[/textarea]

Full article at http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales ... er-7921885

I have no desire to become embroiled in a party political argument but I do see some merit in the Conservative point of view.

I understand fully that governments must make the best use of public money but I would hope that the Welsh Government always looks at CWL first for its trips and only travels from other airports if the financial imperative is compelling. I also realise that on occasions it will make financial sense for Welsh politicians based in North and Mid Wales to use the likes of MAN or BHX for their official journeys.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

[textarea]Cardiff airport seeks more airlines to arrest decline

New Cardiff airport boss Debra Barber has pledged to attract more airlines in an effort to reverse declining passenger numbers.

Latest figures show a 7% drop in the number of passengers in the year to September.

Barber, a former RAF group captain who was appointed the airport's operations director in May 2012, took over as managing director two months ago.

This followed the Welsh government buying the airport for £52 million in March last year following concerns about a lack of investment by the previous owners.[/textarea]

Full article at http://www.travelweekly.co.uk/Articles/ ... cline.html

The CWL MD also speaks of working hard to attract airlines and routes that are sustainable and to recapture passengers who fly from Bristol.

This is an aim that successive managements and owners at CWL have attempted, largely unsuccessfully, but with the likelihood of some state aid for route development and the possibility of devolved APD the chances might be higher this time.

Purely based on the seat selector and currently advertised fares CWL's new weekly Ryanair TFS service seems to be bringing in more passengers per flight than the corresponding Ryanair BRS-TFS whch is 3 x weekly. easyJet's BRS-TFS also 3 x weekly appears to be besting Ryanair at present, again by reference to the seat selector and current fares.

So it's a good sign for CWL with their FR venture and if the trend settles down there might come a time when FR will equalise the TFS rotations and operate 2 x weekly from both CWL and BRS.

CWL has always done well on summer sun and the Canaries but tends to struggle on most other types of route apart from, perhaps surprisingly, Caribbean cruise flights which are always full on the relatively few occasions that they operate.

 

[Aviador]

Long-haul future for Cardiff Airport, says Carwyn Jones

Carwyn Jones is in dreamland if he thinks long haul operators will come to Cardiff airport. It's a case of join the queue with so many other airports throughout the UK chasing new new haul routes. Most if not all will be more likely to get them before Cardiff Airport does.

 

[tpm]

Maybe that needs to be read in conjunction with Cardiff Airport to get loan fund of up to £13m to attract new airlines. £3.5m in the first year alone! That's much much more than what was deemed to be required as subsidy for a NY route in a report a while back, if I recall correctly. And the whole "it's futile to compete with Bristol" bit likely serves to defuse complaints from Bristol airport against the state subsidy/loan.

 

[Em0866]

The way I read it is that a loan for up to $3.5m was being made available in the first year. This does not mean that the whole amount will be used, of course. Neither will be the total $13m (by the way, sorry for the $ but it is an American keyboard I have and there is no pound sign on it)

 

[superking]

i hope this thread is ok with what i have to say.
i see the first rotation yesterday the 1st dec.the atr 42 on the edi run had to turn back due a landing gear problem.
i hope this is not a sign of things to come, as would like to see the route doing well now stobart has supplied the plane for the route.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Probably just one of those things. Apparently the aircraft being used once operated for Air Wales.

I haven't flown in a F50 for many years - the last time was when KLM Cityhopper still used them - but I have recent experience of the ATR, both the 42 and the 72, with Aer Lingus Regional when franchised to Aer Arann and with Aurigney to Guernsey.

My recollection is that the ATR is a bit noisier than the Fokker 50 but not intrusively so. In essence the F50 and the ATR42 are both similar 50-seat (thereabouts) aircraft from the passengers' perspective and I bet most, who will have no interest in aviation, would not be aware that they were different types of aircraft. "Oh, it was a small plane with propellers."

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Apparently a Stobart ATR 72 was used on another day this week, replacing the ATR 42. CityJet had a lot of problems with their F 50s particularly in their early days at CWL with cancellations quite frequent.

I suppose that venerable turbo props are always likely to be more temperamental as they enter old age.

 

[alphagolf]

Article on BBC Wales News website about Long haul being the future for Cardiff Airport, I wholly wish them all the best in this venture, but feel the constant spin in duping the Welsh public is not doing itself any favours, the chief of staff at the airport Jason Thomas has to be said is another of the airport management team to put spin on the report.

He said staff were feeling "really positive going into the new year" after spending the last 18 months stopping the decline of passengers and improving the airport.

"The main thing for the airport is passenger numbers so our focus for the next 12 months - and we know it will be challenging - is to get more airlines and to help grow our existing airlines, who are our lifeblood."

The Welsh government bought Cardiff Airport in a a £52m deal in March 2013, saying it would not be operated by the government and would be managed "at arm's length" and "on a commercial basis".

In November, a Welsh government spokesman said the commercial loan of £3.5m to Cardiff Airport for the development of more routes "will be repaid over a period of up to 12 years".

What he fails to mention is that passenger numbers are now as low as they were 2 years ago and on the verge of dropping below one million, so the Welsh taxpayers should be asking what have we got to show for our £52 million we spent in 2013, yes agree the airport has had a facelift but that isn't the main reason passengers fly from an airport. In times of austerity most potential passengers will vote with there feet based on price, with myself being one of them.

Personal examples:

August 2014 - Tenerife
Price dictated flying from Birmingham, having looked at BRS/CWL/EXT/LGW, cheaper even taking into consideration of a 2hr drive from home to BHX.

August 2015 - Malaga
One key thing I noticed when booking was that neither easyJet/Ryanair (BRS) or Vueling (CWL) were the cheapest. I finally went for an indirect flight from Bristol with Brussels Airlines to Malaga via Brussels, a longer journey but up to £500 cheaper than the loco's from BRS/CWL.

December 2015 - Lanzarote
Currently looking at flights prices and yet again I am looking at not using a local airport, at present the cheapest is looking like it maybe British Airways, based on luggage, seat selection and inflight meals.

The key thing to note is Loco's are not always the be all and end all to any airport, my local airport is Bristol and yes I would prefer to fly from there every time as its only 45mins from home, Cardiff is 1hr 40mins away but the distance I travel doesn't determine the final choice.

I sincerely hope that Cardiff Airport can find its niche in the Long Haul market, Bristol's is obviously Short Haul.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-30631660

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Some good points there alphagolf. All airports seem to indulge in lots of spin - I expect everyone is fed up hearing me going on about it - and Jason Thomas, as CWL's spokesman on this is no exception. Incidentally, is there anything significant in Mr Thomas who is a civil servant attached to CWL with the title chief of staff making this beginning of the year announcement rather than airport MD Debra Barber or Spencer Birns the hard-working director responsible for routes?

Your quote is part of a much longer newspaper article in which Mr Thomas says that CWL can handle any type of aircraft. That's true but an A 380 would have to be extremely lightly loaded on a short haul route to the point where it would make no sense to operate it.

I can't see CWL doing much with long haul scheduled even if APD was devolved to Wales and significantly reduced, with English airports still subject to the current regime.

Long haul charter seems far more likely than long haul scheduled. Some years ago CWL had a very decent long haul programme to the likes of Florida, Dominican Republic, Mexico and Canada together with the relatively short-lived Zoom scheduled services to Canada.

Bristol still seems to harbour hopes of a return to a NYC scheduled service and from all reports I've heard came within a whisker of getting it for this year. There also remains uncertainty about the B 787 and A 350 at BRS. If they can operate from there then the runway disadvantage will all but disappear and it will be down to purely commercial considerations.Therefore, I wouldn't write off BRS just yet as a long haul desert.

As to your price comparisons a friend of mine and his wife were looking to fly to Tenerife in March. They live on the northern edge of Bristol and have no interest in aviation for its own sake. They looked at Monarch from BHX, Ryanair from CWL, BRS and BHX, easyJet from BRS and TOM (flight only) from some of these airports too. Ryanair was the cheapest for the dates they were looking at - roughly the same price from CWL, BRS and BHX - whereas in total for the two of them easyJet from BRS was nearly £100 dearer than Ryanair.

They are very protective of their money usually and it surprised me to learn that they had elected to fly with easyJet from BRS on the basis that even though they are not 'into' aviation they had heard bad reports of Ryanair's customer relations in the media and didn't want to risk being left high and dry. They seemed a bit nonplussed when I said that although I'd never flown with Ryanair I understand the airline to be no worse generally in getting you to your destination than anyone else. Perhaps this is why easyJet often charges more than Ryanair on some comparable routes from BRS.

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Strong rumours are flying around that some sort of route announcement is to be made tomorrow in connection with CWL. It's not believed to relate to Links Air which itself said recently that it was looking to expand its operations from CWL now that it is the holder of the Cardiff-Anglesey PSO contract.

 

[Em0866]

There has been lots of speculation on tomorrow's expected announcement. From what I have also read on that said forum, it will not be a major announcement either. Even if it is a minor announcement, I hope it will make way for a more positive year for the airport.

Happy New Year to you Local!

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Whatever it is will be one positive step along the road to recovery..............from little acorns and all that.

Thank you for your good wishes E m which I reciprocate with pleasure.

 

[Em0866]

Thanks Local

Yes I agree. Watch this space tomorrow!

 

[TheLocalYokel]

It's Flybe to Dusseldorf, effectively replacing the withdrawn Germanwings service on this route. I'll put the details in the CWL Flybe thread.

 

[Em0866]

Completely out of the blue, but very welcome

 

[TheLocalYokel]

Completely out of the blue, but very welcome

Links seems to be on the verge of announcing something too. Might be a week or two yet though but it will have to come soon if it's to start at the beginning of the 'summer' period (ie the end of March). So far nothing more from Ryanair which many hoped would be expanding. Not too late for that either but, again, any announcement needs to come quickly for summer 2015.

The climate across the UK seems as favourable as it's been for a number of years in terms of air travel so there must be optimism going forward at CWL.