Cardiff: Qatar Airways, will it return?
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Tinkerman
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- Jun 25, 2011
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Wow this really is one to scream from the rooftops ! Well done to CWL, this is huge news.
Another example of success breeding success i'm sure. Probably a few times weekly B787 i imagine, what do QR usually do frequency-wise on their routes ? A daily B787 would be far too much i think, although you never know, this kind of service will have a huge catchment.
CWL better start expanding that departure lounge big-time !
Another example of success breeding success i'm sure. Probably a few times weekly B787 i imagine, what do QR usually do frequency-wise on their routes ? A daily B787 would be far too much i think, although you never know, this kind of service will have a huge catchment.
CWL better start expanding that departure lounge big-time !
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Tinkerman
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Certainly is, i did wonder how there was a DOH bound jet at CWL last week, must have been this. Cheers to SWAG for the information once again. Success breeds success, and if other carriers can see this happening, they'll want a slice of the pie for themselves too. KLM may be a little worried with this mind.
TheLocalYokel
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Incredible news for CWL. I can't see the route being anything but a success. It will raise the CWL profile to a substantial degree and will almost certainly be a catalyst for further growth, including new airlines.
I've long said that a MEB3 route from either CWL or BRS would be far more important than a NYC route and, until recently, I believed that BRS's larger and more affluent catchment would see it chosen. However, a few weeks ago I heard one or two comments from people who know a thing or two about the business that led me to think that perhaps CWL was in pole position after all. In fact, it was a bit more than that and a few weeks ago my alter ego hinted at a Qatar CWL route in the Dried Plum.
My suggestion was received with sarcasm and scepticism by one boorish DP poster (no surprise there) but I decided to bide my time as by then I was pretty confident (but not certain by any means) that he was the one who would look foolish in the end. And so it has proved.
Let's not mince words. This is a huge blow for BRS. I can't see two MEB3 routes from Severnside, not in the foreseeable future anyway.
I've long said that a MEB3 route from either CWL or BRS would be far more important than a NYC route and, until recently, I believed that BRS's larger and more affluent catchment would see it chosen. However, a few weeks ago I heard one or two comments from people who know a thing or two about the business that led me to think that perhaps CWL was in pole position after all. In fact, it was a bit more than that and a few weeks ago my alter ego hinted at a Qatar CWL route in the Dried Plum.
My suggestion was received with sarcasm and scepticism by one boorish DP poster (no surprise there) but I decided to bide my time as by then I was pretty confident (but not certain by any means) that he was the one who would look foolish in the end. And so it has proved.
Let's not mince words. This is a huge blow for BRS. I can't see two MEB3 routes from Severnside, not in the foreseeable future anyway.
Tinkerman
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I did see your post, and i remember the poster who now looks an incredible fool. I was with you on the thought that CWL has long been in pole position for this route for numerous factors, a more supportive airport/owner and a longer runway being two of those.
Aircraft for the route will probably be either B787, B737-8MAX or A321NEO. Personally i would like to see a small er aircraft on the route for more frequency.
Huge blow for BRS and their expansion plans, but a huge coup for CWL this. And as you say i have no doubt that after this announcement today, many a ear has pricked up throughout the aviation world and we may likely see more to follow. This news will have major repercussions for CWL, Wales and the whole of the South-West of the UK. Imagine the tourism from rich Arabs that this is likely to bring ? Huge investment opportunities.
Aircraft for the route will probably be either B787, B737-8MAX or A321NEO. Personally i would like to see a small er aircraft on the route for more frequency.
Huge blow for BRS and their expansion plans, but a huge coup for CWL this. And as you say i have no doubt that after this announcement today, many a ear has pricked up throughout the aviation world and we may likely see more to follow. This news will have major repercussions for CWL, Wales and the whole of the South-West of the UK. Imagine the tourism from rich Arabs that this is likely to bring ? Huge investment opportunities.
TheLocalYokel
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I'm not sure that the runway length would be an issue with a B787. I don't about the other types that might be used. TOM are flying far further with their 787s from BRS than Doha.
In fairness to the BRS owners, they have been and remain extremely supportive of their management with over £200 million spent in the past decade or so on all sorts of infrastructure improvements.
The differences in approach of the two owners (one private, the other public) perhaps vary in that the pension fund that owns BRS is always (rightly) looking at the balance sheet and will support anything that will add value to it. So, for example, two extra easyJet routes would generate more footfall (to feed the ancillary revenue streams) than a Qatar service.
The Welsh Government, although mindful that they are spending public money on their airport (or at least they ought to be mindful), have a wider remit in that they are looking at boosting the Welsh economy with a return to airport profitability of lesser importance to them in the short to medium term. I have no doubt whatever that the WG, through their airport company, have liberally oiled the wheels of this deal.
In fairness to the BRS owners, they have been and remain extremely supportive of their management with over £200 million spent in the past decade or so on all sorts of infrastructure improvements.
The differences in approach of the two owners (one private, the other public) perhaps vary in that the pension fund that owns BRS is always (rightly) looking at the balance sheet and will support anything that will add value to it. So, for example, two extra easyJet routes would generate more footfall (to feed the ancillary revenue streams) than a Qatar service.
The Welsh Government, although mindful that they are spending public money on their airport (or at least they ought to be mindful), have a wider remit in that they are looking at boosting the Welsh economy with a return to airport profitability of lesser importance to them in the short to medium term. I have no doubt whatever that the WG, through their airport company, have liberally oiled the wheels of this deal.
Massive news, To attract a airline in the calibre of Qatar to CWL cannot be underestimated, The benefits to both the airport, the city of Cardiff and the country as a whole is hugely beneficial in what I'd say is a huge turning point, The potential use of the service for the catchments of both Wales, the Midlands and the wealthy southwest catchment means I'd be stunned if this wasn't a success like you've said Local, It's not only the airport side of things, it's the business that could be bought into the country, investment opportunities, Job creation, the positive effect on current CWL services, inbound tourism, additional revenue through the airport.
There is a could of interesting points in regards to a LH carrier:
Airbridges - it's a well known fact that the airbridges at CWL are not completely functional in the sense of movement since being placed on concrete blocks to raise many years ago, Qatar services wouldn't have a problem using either gate 7 or 10 providing on the aircraft type:
A332,A333, B788, B789 could use Gate 7
A320, A321 could use Gate 10
However it is worth pointing out that if Qatar did want the airbridge fully manoeuvrable so the middle door is used so economy passengers don't walk through the Business ( FC cabin on some aircraft also) then this would require work in the upcoming winter, The waiting areas aren't really ideal next to either of the gates, 7 is essentially a long corridor with a few chairs put in the middle which is also used for flights using 3 and 8 and 10 has a sort of a waiting area off the corridor which is pretty small, I imagine some work will be done the make it suitable for the airline, will be intriguing to see what happens with the airport infrastructure with seemingly the check in area needing extending with a Qatar focused area with Premium, the area towards the BA maintenance seems the most likely course of action, especially with expanding SH carriers something will need to be done about it sooner rather than later, Could Qatar open up there own lounge potentially on floor 2 ? Will the current one be extended for a larger area; lots of work to be done but I'm pretty sure the airport have the plans already in the place, with work to start after the busy summer period.
Very, very exciting times, coupled with the fact that a potential SH carrier expansion is talked about for next summer, these are exciting times, along with champions league final and now this very much puts Wales and Cardiff on the map, hopefully it's the start of many new exciting developments over the next year or so !
There is a could of interesting points in regards to a LH carrier:
Airbridges - it's a well known fact that the airbridges at CWL are not completely functional in the sense of movement since being placed on concrete blocks to raise many years ago, Qatar services wouldn't have a problem using either gate 7 or 10 providing on the aircraft type:
A332,A333, B788, B789 could use Gate 7
A320, A321 could use Gate 10
However it is worth pointing out that if Qatar did want the airbridge fully manoeuvrable so the middle door is used so economy passengers don't walk through the Business ( FC cabin on some aircraft also) then this would require work in the upcoming winter, The waiting areas aren't really ideal next to either of the gates, 7 is essentially a long corridor with a few chairs put in the middle which is also used for flights using 3 and 8 and 10 has a sort of a waiting area off the corridor which is pretty small, I imagine some work will be done the make it suitable for the airline, will be intriguing to see what happens with the airport infrastructure with seemingly the check in area needing extending with a Qatar focused area with Premium, the area towards the BA maintenance seems the most likely course of action, especially with expanding SH carriers something will need to be done about it sooner rather than later, Could Qatar open up there own lounge potentially on floor 2 ? Will the current one be extended for a larger area; lots of work to be done but I'm pretty sure the airport have the plans already in the place, with work to start after the busy summer period.
Very, very exciting times, coupled with the fact that a potential SH carrier expansion is talked about for next summer, these are exciting times, along with champions league final and now this very much puts Wales and Cardiff on the map, hopefully it's the start of many new exciting developments over the next year or so !
Tinkerman
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- Jun 25, 2011
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Excellent post that Craig. Your comments make some increasingly valid points, and the infrastructure at CWL to support this new service is something that will need addressing.
- Qatar Lounge - I'm guessing that Qatar will want their own lounge at CWL like they have at many other airports throughout the UK and across the world. Luckily for CWL there is a lot of space for this kind of thing to be built, albeit not within the current airside area so we may have to see some changes there.
- Boarding Areas - Once again i'm assuming QR will want to see an improved area for boarding the flights and the Pier may need some work as a result, and no doubt wallwork with QR decals etc. etc. The airbridges are also a valid point in that they will not want economy boarding through business, that is a fact. So i'm assuming that Business will board using the airbridge, and then economy via steps to the aircraft depending on the aircraft that they choose to use of course. If it is a B737MAX, this is the only aircraft which obviously doesn't have a boardable middle door.
- Check-In Area - Will need inclusion for the QR product, so check-in area for premium and a few economy desks may need improving a little.
And this route will be great for Wales and the surrounding area of the UK. Carwyn Jones has already committed to meeting the Qatari guys on Sunday, so perhaps this route doesn't have WG support since this would have been done before hand otherwise surely ?
Looking forward to the revitalisation that this route will bring to CWL and hopefully it's the stimulus to provide even further growth.
- Qatar Lounge - I'm guessing that Qatar will want their own lounge at CWL like they have at many other airports throughout the UK and across the world. Luckily for CWL there is a lot of space for this kind of thing to be built, albeit not within the current airside area so we may have to see some changes there.
- Boarding Areas - Once again i'm assuming QR will want to see an improved area for boarding the flights and the Pier may need some work as a result, and no doubt wallwork with QR decals etc. etc. The airbridges are also a valid point in that they will not want economy boarding through business, that is a fact. So i'm assuming that Business will board using the airbridge, and then economy via steps to the aircraft depending on the aircraft that they choose to use of course. If it is a B737MAX, this is the only aircraft which obviously doesn't have a boardable middle door.
- Check-In Area - Will need inclusion for the QR product, so check-in area for premium and a few economy desks may need improving a little.
And this route will be great for Wales and the surrounding area of the UK. Carwyn Jones has already committed to meeting the Qatari guys on Sunday, so perhaps this route doesn't have WG support since this would have been done before hand otherwise surely ?
Looking forward to the revitalisation that this route will bring to CWL and hopefully it's the stimulus to provide even further growth.
Tinkerman
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Indeed, Press Release now on the airport's website. Think this will make most people's day, especially you Jerry !
TheLocalYokel
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Qatar does use other lounges than its own at smaller airports around the world. Premium customers would expect a lounge that provided meals though.
Looking at BHX (with a daily Qatar 787 service, 8 weekly in 2016?) 110,500 passengers were carried between Doha and BHX in 2016 with 134,000 between Doha and EDI. The other Qatar UK-Doha airports in 2016 were MAN with 336,000 and LHR with 1.2 million.
Depending on frequency and airport type CWL might expect perhaps 70,000-100,000 in the first year.
Looking at BHX (with a daily Qatar 787 service, 8 weekly in 2016?) 110,500 passengers were carried between Doha and BHX in 2016 with 134,000 between Doha and EDI. The other Qatar UK-Doha airports in 2016 were MAN with 336,000 and LHR with 1.2 million.
Depending on frequency and airport type CWL might expect perhaps 70,000-100,000 in the first year.
kraktoa
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- Jun 16, 2013
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Wow great news for Cardiff. I had in the past suggested through a contact in Qatar that Bristol may pull this one off. Never mind. Mixed feelings for me. Glad its gone to Cardiff as we are bloody over worked in Bristol and Cardiff are twiddling thumbs. Also will defenitely use cardiff for flights to Singapore and Asia.
TheLocalYokel
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The Conservatives have sidelined the idea but with a new government looming who knows? A new Conservative government might look again -there has been some vague political comment that after Brexit there might be a fresh look, assuming Brexit does occur.
If Labour became the new government with the support of the Scots Nats and Plaid Cymru then it's highly likely that PC would demand further tax devolution including APD as part of their price.
- Moderator
- #18
What great news and a huge coup for Cardiff.
I just hope that you don't have the 5 year wait that Birmingham and Helsinki did between announcement and commencement
Seriously though, it's fabulous news for the region, well done CWL 👍
I just hope that you don't have the 5 year wait that Birmingham and Helsinki did between announcement and commencement
Seriously though, it's fabulous news for the region, well done CWL 👍
Brummiegem
Well-Known Member
Yes,this is fantastic news for Cardiff.
However the hard work starts here and this is where you guys can do your bit.
Advertising is crucial.Making people aware of any new route/service is absolutely key to making it both viable and then successful.
In my role at BHX it never ceases to amaze me how many people are not aware of certain services or routes available from the airport.In fact 20 years on,there are still many people unaware of a regular flight to NYC.
When talking to friends,relatives and work colleagues get the word out there.You never know when mentioning a new service to a single person or a family,could make a real difference in making the route a big success.That person or family could be involved in big business,so could have a knock on effect.
Anyway great to see a different airport get a new airline and a great route.
Nice one guys👍🙂
However the hard work starts here and this is where you guys can do your bit.
Advertising is crucial.Making people aware of any new route/service is absolutely key to making it both viable and then successful.
In my role at BHX it never ceases to amaze me how many people are not aware of certain services or routes available from the airport.In fact 20 years on,there are still many people unaware of a regular flight to NYC.
When talking to friends,relatives and work colleagues get the word out there.You never know when mentioning a new service to a single person or a family,could make a real difference in making the route a big success.That person or family could be involved in big business,so could have a knock on effect.
Anyway great to see a different airport get a new airline and a great route.
Nice one guys👍🙂
- Moderator
- #20
Honestly I was gobsmacked! I think I'm not the only one! This is massive news not just for the airport but Wales itself. This has the potential to bring in a lot of investment into the area. From what I've seen on Twitter it looks like the Welsh Government trade mission which I think is based in Dubai has been involved in this working with the airport.
I don't think Qatar will have it's own lounge they'll probably use the airport one but provide a special service for the Qatar customers. The aircraft will be interesting whether it's a 787 or A321. For it to be effective business wise the frequency will need to be at least 4 weekly. Also it'll be a valid excuse to revamp and invest in the pier and maybe even get in new air bridges. Really exciting times for CWL and Wales!
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